[303rd-Talk] 303rd BG B-17Fs in postwar Oklahoma

[Thunderp51 at aol.com]

In May 2005 I posted on the Oklahoma Wreckchasing  board 
(http://okwreckchasing.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=635) the following but  only got a couple of 
responses: 


L. Thompson 
Registered Member  
Joined: 14 May 2005 
Posts: 2 
Location: Kellogg, Idaho 
Posted:  Sat May 14, 2005 4:31 pm 
Post subject: Postwar Oklahoma B-17Fs 


Steve  Birdsall's book, Pride of Seattle-The Story of the First 300 B-17Fs 
mentions  three B-17Fs that were intended for Service Station (to be called "The 
Flying  Service") use. These three were said to be disassembled and trucked 
to Oklahoma  City: 

B-17F 41-24605 KNOCK-OUT DROPPER (the first 8th AF B-17 to  complete 50 
missions. 303rd BG, 359th BS 
B-17F Yankee Doodle Dandy (My note:  I assume this was B-17F-45-BO, 42-5264 
of the 303rd BG, 358th BS that was at  Stillwater with RFC on 24 Sept 1945.) 
B-17F 41-24577 heck'S ANGELS 303rd BG,  358th BS 

Birdsall says on page 54, "KNOCK-OUT DROPPER was last reported  in April of 
1948 near an ice dock near NW 39th Street and Pennsylvania Avenue in  Oklahoma 
City." On page 59 he publishes a photo of it minus wings resting on  wooden 
blocks in Oklahoma City in 1946. 

Color plates of heck'S ANGELS  and KNOCK-OUT DROPPER appear on pages 36-37. 
Text and photos seen between pages  51-59. 

Now here is a twist in a story possibly related to these. In 1992  I talked 
with an exotic and classic automobile broker in Florida on the phone.  He was 
pretty good friends with my boss at the time, another dealer in classic  and 
antique autos. The Florida man (his name in buried in some old file I have  I'm 
sure) said he was contacted in the 70s or early 80s about a fleet of old but  
very original Army staff cars that were available for sale in rural Oklahoma. 
He  traveled to see them thinking they may be good hire out candidates for 
Hollywood  World War II movies. He reported to me that they were all derelict 
Dodge or  Plymouth 4-door sedans and he guessed their real value to be minimal 
and not  worth the investment on speculation for movie work. He asked the owner 
if he had  anything else of interest and the man said, "I have two old B-17s." 
The car  dealer told me they were parked in a remote field well off the 
beaten path, and  he was allowed to board them and sit in the cockpits. One had an 
old log book  sitting on the seat. He told me he really knew nothing about the 
vintage  aircraft market and assumed they had no value, even though they were 
fascinating  to see and touch. He actually asked me that day on the phone in 
1992, "Aren't  there hundreds of those old bombers still parked in the desert 
in Arizona?"  
Needless to say in several subsequent conversations I tried to find out as  
much as I could of these fabled lost B-17s. I was unsuccessful in that quest.  
The car dealer was very willing to help. He said he kept meticulous files on 
his  car finder work, and marveled that after much searching that he could not 
find  any record of the Oklahoma seller's name, location, or phone. 
Now I knew my  civil B-17 history well enough to know that aside from a 
couple of B-17s  witnessed by Altus residents in 1946 being trucked away by an 
unknown buyer,  that these two Oklahoma aircraft matched no known surviving B-17s. 
After  arriving at nothing but dead ends I finally put this story away in the 
Lost  Myths and Ones That Got Away file. 
One of the only clues the car dealer  could remember as to location was that 
it was in a spot where a new Interstate  was to come through. This is why the 
seller was offering the cars and the  airplanes. His property was being sold 
to make way for the new freeway.  
Could it be that these planned Service Station B-17s could have survived  
another 30 years or so to languish in some remote corner of Oklahoma? One would  
think they would have been spotted from the air many many years ago and thus 
be  well known. 
Today I got thinking, but what if they were stored with wings  detached? I 
can't honestly say that I ever asked the car dealer about that.  

Stuff that daydreams are made of right? Stranger things have happened...  

Back to top 


TangoRomeo  
Registered Member 
Joined: 26 Mar 2004 
Posts: 7 
Location: Enid,  OK 
Posted: Sun May 15, 2005 12:54 am 


L. Thompson wrote:  

One of the only clues the car dealer could remember as to location was  that 
it was in a spot where a new Interstate was to come through. This is why  the 
seller was offering the cars and the airplanes. His property was being sold  
to make way for the new freeway. 


Hmmm. I suppose I'm really just  thinking out loud more than anything else, 
but that sounds amazingly like an  abandoned private airport named Jane's 
Pasture. It was located just south of  Tinker AFB. When Interstate 240 was built 
around the south side of Oklahoma City  in the late '60s or early '70s, it cut 
directly across the northern part of the  runway. I have a 1974-1975 version of 
the Directory of Oklahoma Airports and the  included aerial photo clearly 
shows the two sections of the runway. The airport  operated in this condition for 
a time, but appears to be completely abandoned  now. A 2002 TerraServer image 
of the area shows only a faint trace of the south  end of the runway, located 
just east of the small lake. 

I worked in the  control tower at Tinker in the early '70s, and every once in 
a while we would  have to monitor an operation into or out of the airport, 
since it was located  within our Airport Traffic Area. Looking at the airport 
through binoculars, one  could see what appeared to be numerous vintage 
automobiles parked on the  property. I don't recall seeing anything that looked like a 
B-17, but if they  were disassembled they could have been stored inside the 
building that was on  the property. Anyway, it's a long shot. Just thought I 
would mention it. Oh yes,  the TerraServer image can be seen at 
_http://www.terraserver.microsoft.com/image.aspx?T=4&S=11&Z=14&X=1611&Y=9790&W=1._ 
(http://www.terraserver.microsoft.com/image.aspx?T=4&S=11&Z=14&X=1611&Y=9790&W=1.)   The 
area is pretty well built up now, but in the early '70s it was still quite  
rural. Also, I will be happy to email a copy of the 1974 photo if anyone is  
interested, provided I can get a good scan of it. 


I took a  version of the story (minus the airplanes) to some vintage military 
vehicle web  sites and experts and they offered some ideas on who the owner 
of the vehicles  may have been. Haven't chased those leads much yet. 

I spoke with Scott  Thompson once ortwice about it and this was his last 
correspondence to me about  it: 

"Thanks for your message. I have  heard of these airplanes {my note: the 
three with identities} and have a few  photos of them. I also have tucked away 
somewhere a column from the Oklahoma  City newspaper, probably fifteen years ago, 
that addresses these airplanes. As I  recall (it's not in front of me right 
now) it indicated the airplanes were later  buried when the lot was vacated. 

These airplanes came out of Searcy  Field (the one Paul Mantz bought) at 
Stillwater. They were disassembled and  trucked to OKC. Reportedly, Bob Sturges 
saw the one airplane mounted over the  gas station and suggested that idea to 
Art Lacey for his gas station near  Portland. 

These airplanes were not covered in the updated Final Cut,  though they 
probably should have been. As for the two B-17s in rural Oklahoma,  they could be 
the same airplanes, though I'd think not. They could be off the  field at 
Altus, who knows? 

I'll tuck this one away for reflection. I get  to Oklahoma quite a bit and it 
might be worth figuring out what interstates were  built in the early 
1990s...not many, I'd guess. 

If I come up with  anything I'll let you know. We can each get a B-17." 


My New  Years resolution is to go through dozens of big boxes in the basement 
until I  find the name of the Florida car broker again. 

Lowell  Thompson